Disappointed with results

The discussion of the Linus Pauling vitamin C/lysine invention for chronic scurvy

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ckaye
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Disappointed with results

Post Number:#1  Post by ckaye » Thu Sep 25, 2014 1:15 pm

About a year back, my GP did an ultrasound of my carotid arteries, femoral arteries, and whatever the arteries are called on the back side of the knee. They showed very slight soft plaque/fatty deposits behind the knees, and one of the carotids and femorals.

I came across this site about 5 months later, and have been high-dosing C and lysine and proline, to what I believe is bowel tolerance (about 20-25 gm/day), sipping the mix throughout the day.

I went back last week for another scan, and there was no improvement. I was hoping/expecting to not see what appeared last time, but had no such luck.

So the question is, do I just keep plugging away and give it some more time? Is it possible it just won't work for me? Any guidance at all would be appreciated.

Thanks.

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#2  Post by jimmylesante » Thu Sep 25, 2014 1:44 pm

I would add Vit K2, magnesium and sunshine.
I'm sure we'd like to know what amounts of everything you are taking and perhaps your age bracket.
Also divide the doses of VC et al through out the day and drink within 15mins of mixing. Also try not to take around same times as diuretics(coffee/tea/caffeine or sugars.
Bon chance

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#3  Post by tjohnson_nb » Thu Sep 25, 2014 8:03 pm

ckaye wrote: to what I believe is bowel tolerance (about 20-25 gm/day), sipping the mix throughout the day.

Reaching bowel tolerance is not a question of belief :)
'Always' and 'never' are 2 words you should always remember never to use.

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#4  Post by ofonorow » Fri Sep 26, 2014 8:13 am

They showed very slight soft plaque/fatty deposits behind the knees, and one of the carotids and femorals.


Do you have any other symptoms besides these tests? If "very slight" you may be in the realm of measurement error.
Owen R. Fonorow, Orthopath® (Orthomolecular Naturopath)
® is a trademark of the Institute for Orthomolecular Studies

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#5  Post by jimmylesante » Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:40 am

Do you have any other symptoms besides these tests? If "very slight" you may be in the realm of measurement error.

Very organised GP you have... Perhaps he has a faulty machine?

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#6  Post by jofuk » Sun Oct 12, 2014 3:48 am

Hi,
Sad not see not many replies to your report.
I also have mild carotid stenosis on my left side ( that was over a year ago) so have be on the PT plus Tocotrienols, and B vits since.
Have a read in a PUBMED report that 90 mgs per day of Tocotrienols can reduce carotid plaque. (check out - Swanson Ultra Tocotrienols (99% Tocopherol Free, also read Dr Tann).
Am looking for the reference and will post when find it again.
Also look up on PUBMED - Decrease of carotid intima-media thickness in patients at risk to cerebral ischemia after supplementation with folic acid, Vitamins B6 and B12.
Hope this helps.
I will have another scan on my carotid when the screening company are next in town - my own doctor will not repeat scan.
Keep researching.
Regards.

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#7  Post by purposefirst » Sun Oct 12, 2014 5:29 pm

check out - Swanson Ultra Tocotrienols


The Swanson product may be very good, but Swanson is a mass supplier of supplements at lower prices. Who makes a supplement sometimes makes a difference in the quality. "Unique E" brand has been highly touted on this site. (I just recently began using Unique E Tocotrienol myself. Too early to say anything about results).

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#8  Post by ckaye » Tue Oct 21, 2014 5:35 pm

Thanks for all of the replies, I appreciate the feedback. To answer the responses in order:

Jimmy - I take Life Extension Super K2 every day, as well as 800-1000mg of magnesium. I try to get outside whenever I can, but it's difficult as I work an office job all day.

Tjohnson - Good one.

Owen - No symptoms at all at this point; the scans are the only objective evidence I have of what's going on.

Jimmy - Don't think the machine's faulty; he previously did scans of my thyroid as well as my wife's, and they appeared properly. I was watching the screen with him as he rubbed the wand with the goo all over me (didn't even have to pay extra for that fun...), and the deposits on the arterial wall are clearly visible.

Jofuk - Vitamin E is one vitamin I have not been taking, but I've been meaning to look into it further. I just keep forgetting... As for B vitamins, I have one of the MTHFR gene mutations, so I have to take methylfolate and methylcobalamin, which I do daily. Didn't discover this until about a year ago, so maybe the previous 40 years of this mutation have been contributing to the problem, but I doubt it.

Anyways, I'm continuing on with the C, lysine, and proline. The worst case scenario is that nothing happens, right? Versus a potential significant upside, albeit an upside I have yet to see...

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#9  Post by ofonorow » Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:44 pm

and the deposits on the arterial wall are clearly visible.


Can you find out and tell us more about the machine that was used that made arterial deposits "clearly visible". This could be an important development.

I remember we had a friend who is now a Reverend, went to Chiropractic school, and wanted us to market an ultrasound device. He insisted that we find portable ultrasound machines to "prove" the effectiveness of the pauling therapy (as his doctor was able to use to prove to him how well it worked.)

If there is a way for people to measure their own plaque, for now, even with the help of an ultrasound specialist, that could be quite a break through.
Owen R. Fonorow, Orthopath® (Orthomolecular Naturopath)
® is a trademark of the Institute for Orthomolecular Studies

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#10  Post by ckaye » Tue Dec 30, 2014 6:08 pm

Sorry for the terribly long delay.

It was just a simple ultrasound machine. Ran it over carotids, femorals, and back of my knees, and plaque deposits show up as white spots (in my case; I imagine heavier build up would reflect as solid white lines or patches).

The next time I see him I'll try to get photocopies of the ultrasounds and upload them, but that may be a month or two.

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#11  Post by nineboy » Wed Dec 31, 2014 1:26 pm

Hi All, Well that would be something I'd like to check out. To be able to actually see how things were going inside you. That would be worth a look.
For myself I am still doing away quite well. Still taking my daily dose of Vitamin C plus Lysine and Proline 3 times a day. Plus all my other vitamins I take. Yes I probably Shake, rattle and roll a bit, with them all. I keep unplugging away and feel my stents are clear but have no way to really know that. Right now I feel better than I have all year and my pacemaker, well I am not really aware of it. I feel good! Yes, Still taking my medications as well and feel Metoprolol 3 times 25mg seems to be working for me. Still managing to keep up with my walking and danced up a storm just before Christmas, so all is well.
I would like to again thank this site for all the information given and would like to wish you all a Happy, Healthy New Year. Regards nineboy. :D :D

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#12  Post by ofonorow » Wed Dec 31, 2014 2:04 pm

Thank you nineboy for the report.

Okay, it sounds like what our Reverend (trained as a chiropractor friend) wanted us to do. Sell ultrasound machines so we (he) could see what is going on in our blood vessels before and after taking the Pauling therapy... He was amazed after his visits and ultrasound readings apparently... We started to look into this.. maybe we'll restart..


ckaye wrote:Sorry for the terribly long delay.

It was just a simple ultrasound machine. Ran it over carotids, femorals, and back of my knees, and plaque deposits show up as white spots (in my case; I imagine heavier build up would reflect as solid white lines or patches).

The next time I see him I'll try to get photocopies of the ultrasounds and upload them, but that may be a month or two.
Owen R. Fonorow, Orthopath® (Orthomolecular Naturopath)
® is a trademark of the Institute for Orthomolecular Studies

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#13  Post by Montmorency » Fri Sep 04, 2015 2:20 pm

Re: ultrasound, this is quite an old article:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8521067.stm

And the price mentioned there was off-putting.
Presumably there are cheaper devices available now.

Edit: found some sub-£1000 devices on Ebay, but they seem to be aimed at the pregnant mother market.
Not found anything specific to cardiac work.

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#14  Post by jimmylesante » Sat Sep 05, 2015 2:31 am

I assume the ultrasound machine is like the ones they use in hospital- had my carotids and VA done in a stroke ward and showed normal. Whether it showed up plaque or not i'm not sure. I didn't ask at the time and somehow assume they were checking the blood flow volume which of course would change if any blockages and not actually seeing the plaque.
Having said that we use ultrasound to show up injured muscles so seeing a calcium plaque seems likely.....
I guess the positive for ckaye is that the second ultrasound didn't show it had worsened.
Importantly Vitamin C etc is not the magic bullet IF one continues smoking drinking and eating badly with no exercise(not they i say you do any of these ckaye) But my point is change of lifestyle is the first step as well as boosting with supplements.

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Re: Disappointed with results

Post Number:#15  Post by ofonorow » Mon Sep 07, 2015 10:32 am

Any news?

Reviewing this topic and saw this



Jofuk - Vitamin E is one vitamin I have not been taking, but I've been meaning to look into it further. I just keep forgetting...


For those reading with heart disease, and not taking vitamin E (perhaps due to the bad press), know that vitamin E supplementation is more than important, i.e., low blood levels of vitamin E are (is) the number one predictor of a heart attack.

Linus Pauling's chapter on heart disease in HOW TO LIVE LONGER AND FEEL BETTER (1986) was devoted to vitamin E and the Shute brothers.

My father took vitamin E his entire adult life, but ran out (and didn't buy more) two weeks before his heart attack. (He died during the angioplasty after that heart attack.) My brother, Mike Till Sr., ran out of vitamin E, did not buy more, and had his first heart attack 2 weeks later. (We subsequently discovered that the "gestation" period in the bone marrow for certain blood cells (maybe platelets.. memory fades) is roughly two weeks. Coincidence? Maybe.)

Then there is the WHO study that supports the first claim, and this bears repeating,


Several authors have pointed to an extensive study conducted by the World Health Organization on thousands of men and women from sixteen nations. The study illustrated that a low level of vitamin E in the blood was more than twice as predictive of heart attack than either high cholesterol or high blood pressure. Inverse correlation between plasma vitamin E and mortality from ischemic heart disease in cross-cultural epidemiology.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1985406


And yes, we recommend the original (mixed tocopherols) Unique-E brand of Vitamin E from A. C. Grace and we have no financial interest in this product what-so-ever.
Owen R. Fonorow, Orthopath® (Orthomolecular Naturopath)
® is a trademark of the Institute for Orthomolecular Studies


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